Comparing the Psychological Profiles of Two Villain's Mothers

My fans (readers of my online writing) know that I enjoy the comic book inspired movies and shows put out by DC and Marvel. I was making a joke today about how Superman can not be true to the comic book scripts about him anymore because the modern setting just doesn't allow him to be the Superman we all know and love from the comic books. No payphones? Yeah, Superman is done. However, Batman and The Xmen can still do lots of stuff in the modern world even if their comic books were written long ago. Though I haven't written a review yet on the great recent release of "Deadpool and Wolverine" I do want to discuss what I've been noticing about the Max show "Penguin" and the Todd Phillips film "Joker". Both depictions (of Arthur and of Oz) show us very profound characters (their mothers) who were a significant piece of the psychological mystery of villain development. I would like to share my analysis as I profile both Arthur's mother and Oz's mother in comparative form.

Of course the producers, writers, and directors of the films and shows take liberties with the archetype characters and don't always stick exactly to the original comic book stories. Having said that, I'm focusing my analysis on what we (the fans and audience) were shown specifically in the "Joker" film of 2019, and the recent Max show "Penguin" which just ended the first season in 2024.

Penny Fleck (played by Frances Conroy) is Arthur's (Joker's) mother. Frances Cobb (played by Deirdre O'Connell) is Oz's (Penguin's) mother. These two mothers of Gotham's famous villains share much in common, yet there are also significant differences in the relationships with their sons who both became notorious villains.

Both Penny and Frances suffer health issues. Penny is diagnosed as mentally ill and is depicted as weak, frail, and not in the best of health. Frances is noted as having Parkinsons disease which causes some mental health issues such as hallucinations, flashbacks, and delusions. In the film "Joker" we get some information about Penny's pregnancy. We are led to believe that either she was never pregnant with Arthur and has simply raised him as her son delusionally, or that she was pregnant with Arthur and rejected by Arthur's father. With Frances, we do not know yet what her pregnancy with Oz was like, but we do know that Oz had two brothers. Besides their health issues, the two mothers commonality includes the fact that they are very much adored and loved by their sons.

Where are the significant differences? To my eyes, the differences are quite easy to recognize. Penny's treatment of Arthur is very different compared to Frances's treatment of Oz. Where Arthur had the burden of forgiveness with Penny, Frances had the burden of forgiveness with Oz. Arthur was supposed to forgive his mother for not being able to love him properly since she was rejected by his father. Frances was supposed to forgive Oz for killing his two brothers. Arthur did not forgive his mother, instead he murdered her. Frances did not forgive Oz, and almost had him killed, but chose to stand by him and continue to cheerlead for him even if he was less than perfect.

These histories and pyschological profiles continue to fascinate a fan like me as I analyze the motivations and driving forces behind the mastermind villainy. Joker as an archetype character has entertained and amazed DC fans for decades. Penguin is just beginning to raise eyebrows again. Because their mothers and family origins were similar and different at the same time, a profiler like me can come to some conclusions about their psychologies. The Joker could not really love his mother because she could not really love him. Since his father had rejected her while she was pregnant, their love was doomed from the start. Penguin's seemingly obsessive love for his mother is based on the fact, that subconsciously he knew that she knew he had killed her other sons and chose to love him anyway. Even if Frances could not forgive him out of respect and love for his dead brothers, she still did not punish him the way Penny punished Arthur for the sins of his father. In Penny's defense, I will say that the city and their sociological "help" was not very effective, which was also displayed while Arthur sought help from the shrinks for his mental health issues. If it really "takes a village to raise a child" then the village failed tremendously in the Arthur/Penny case.

Though both villains are created from poverty, a missing link father, and growing up in a violent crime loaded city, their mother's individualities sets them apart psychologically and gives them different motivations.