LET'S TALK ABOUT VEGETARIANS

LET’S TALK ABOUT VEGETARIANS

controversial subjects with effects can

be tense but we are a subsides here to

make things make sense

veganism all right that's what we're

talking about today right term veganism

yeah like vegetarianism oh wow yeah I

don't know why it sounds so weird but

yeah like you are a vegan or a

vegetarian but yeah I know so that's

what we're talking about today uh we're

mainly gonna be focusing on uh its

impact on your health like it because I

feel like obviously spoiler alert like

for the most part it's like or for every

part it's better for the environment

we'll touch on that

um but the question is is it actually

better or worse for your body and your

brain and your health is that like a

contentious issue online I think yeah

for a long time I think that was the

concern I think it's the concern of many

people who maybe are considering like

even going vegetarian or vegan but feel

that there's like something else yeah

whether it's from just being conditioned

that like without like you need meat in

your diet or that there's not enough

protein there have been some studies in

the past who have had contradicting

results but the big thing is that um

we're only really getting research in

now that's been able to have like a long

enough tail to actually come to some

conclusions about this or that's been

significant enough because the vegan

population is growing so much that

there's actually a good comparison and

good studies so we'll be talking about

things like

um like Teeth quality bone density

strength is it better for you when

you're like an athlete is it better for

your overall health and your heart your

longevity cancers diseases those kind of

things but we're talking about whoa

that's a big it's a big pile but there's

lots of studies that are now looking

into it because like the group of people

who are committed vegans is growing and

so obviously it's important for just

like General like Health stats to

understand and then there's lots of

people who are wanting to join the vegan

movement

um and care about like okay is there

something I need to know what should I

know what will I be missing if I go

vegan yeah the study that I found about

teeth was interesting

and it was not that informative about

why these things were happening I feel

like a lot of these studies probably are

just large groups of people yeah finding

the data but not knowing exactly like

the back because there's so many called

mechanisms and there's like a lot of

confounding variables so I just like

made a video on this it'll be out like

Tomorrow based on this pod but I'm sure

people can watch it by the time they

hear this

um and it's like a lot of like there's

different traits in different groups

right so vegans behave differently yeah

not just the way they eat but probably

the way they live their lives and yeah

the things they have access to and the

countries they come from were like the

what is surrounding them so it's hard

sometimes to know when something is just

because of the food like as a simple

example like vegans smoke less and drink

less so obviously that's going to have

like larger implications on their lives

that will impact their health and it

might be easy to say oh they have like

less a lung cancer but it's like oh they

actually also just smoke yeah like

that's not necessarily the impact of

like eating vegan yeah so it's I'm

better and better quality studies are

starting to come out to be able to parse

through those differences yeah so this

was studying oral health and found that

omnivores so not vegans or vegetarians

their gums would bleed more upon the

probing method so they would actually

like like if they were being like

scratched they would like do this thing

to their gums and they would bleed when

they were omnivores and then there was a

decrease in infections and inflammation

in the vegans and vegetarians compared

to omnivores in the mouth and gums oh so

wait omnivores would bleed more and

they'd have more omnivores that have

more infections in inflammation but

there was higher dental erosion in

vegans and vegetarians they again don't

know why this was just like a large

study of people but that is related to

acid like a lot of a consumption of acid

like in terms of their dental erosion

this was just like yeah maybe lots of

fruits and veggies are almost like

acidic that like that's all the studies

that was about acid they didn't even

explain

if that was because there's more fruits

and veg they just were like it's from

Acid so what does that mean it's like I

kind of was thinking to myself would you

be having more acidic things as a vegan

like I didn't think about it like I mean

if you're generally consuming more

fruits and veggies like obviously lots

are not acidic but I don't know more

Tomatoes more apples yeah yeah apple

like there are lots of things that

if you were only eating meat which

obviously not that many people just only

me but well it's not like so weird that

like some people do sometimes on my Tick

Tock someone's like oh you just I'm like

that is absolutely repulsive and also

like 1 000 bad for you like I don't even

like I never got to the part of the

video where they try and explain why

that could even be good here's what I'll

say there's no way

here's what I'll say this is me always

being the like hey let if this wasn't

like if it didn't have such an impact on

the environment and animal cruelty and

these kind of things I would just say

like whatever if it makes you feel good

and you're whatever like that's fine

okay and I think the human body is very

adaptable there's obviously lots of

nutrients and essential things in meat

like and fish and like lots of

Alternatives so oh my God think about

the farts alone oh of course but um I

just mean like fine I'm sure your body

could survive on just me like some

people survive on just like basic

necessities like right yeah no I know it

could probably survive it's just funny

when people are like I'm so committed to

being like a cure-all too yeah it's like

wait like no vegetables or fruit like I

don't know I just it makes me great yeah

and we've known for like decades if not

even longer that vegetables are like

generally associated with good health

yeah I know it's like it's like okay

anyway it's moving on we don't need to

talk about that no no it's interesting

actually though I will add making a

video about the Omi diet

yeah just like like what are the impacts

of if you only eat meat both good and

bad

um I know we're like I'm kind of backing

up here but in case anyone isn't sure or

didn't realize like the difference

between vegetarian and veganism

obviously is that vegans don't eat

anything related to animals and that

includes like eggs milk cheese things

that are like associated with animals

but not necessarily meat yeah so they

will say like we've we're currently not

vegetarian we've started eating meat

again in small amounts but before we

were vegetarian for like two years and

it is like we still did consume a lot of

dairy like it is oh yeah it was like

such a difference only ever tried maybe

once to do veganism yeah we did it for

like four or five months and it was like

it is like interesting how much

dare how much of a difference I think

that is between being vegan and

vegetarian it is for me it felt very

different yeah I mean like from the

outside it's like it's not that

different doesn't seem that different

but in terms of your choices and your

cognitive like awareness has to be much

higher to be a vegan yeah and maybe once

you get in the flow it's just as easy

but for me vegetarian was like at least

a place that I could always know I

didn't have to question and look at

ingredients all the time that was an

easier step to enter into than when we

try to be vegan and it was like I'm Stan

and also like insanely neurotic I would

be like standing at every item I was

buying if it wasn't a whole food looking

at the ingredients and so it it is like

today we're talking about vegans yeah

and many studies Clump them together

which is a problem which is good in some

ways like of course like if you're just

trying to understand eating more

vegetables and fruit what is that impact

maybe it's fine to Clump them together

but I think that's why more research is

coming out now that's able to

differentiate between these kinds of

diets because previously like they would

just be all the same huh if you didn't

eat meat you were just like part of this

other group that didn't eat meat yeah

but they are like it's pretty

significantly I love vegan

um yeah no no like I have the utmost

respect I'm always just like slay all

day Mama yeah no it's and it is

interesting no it's true like I

question why we haven't gone vegan

and because dead silent well the

craziest part of it is I had an insane I

didn't realize I had an insane parasite

but I got this second I started being

vegan and I was like oh my God I'm so

sick oh my God I'm losing so much weight

like all this stuff and then I

simultaneously found out I had Giardia

lamblia and it was like from drinking

from Costa Rican stream water that like

I'm like it is crazy how much that looks

scarred you yeah it's like I need to

remember and go back and try again

um uh yeah no I I'm a like I'm a lazy

piece of [ __ ] it's a lot it's not like

it's a lot it only gets a lot of work

but I care about

um like I really eat thinking about

nutrients and stuff like that and I and

I think it takes more time and need to

prioritize it yeah I would love to say

that I'm and be vegan I think this step

is going out for dinner and yeah I don't

know but now like we live in such a

world where you can eat vegan and very

yummy and very well and very unhealthy

if you want to

um but I think like

it's also important to acknowledge and

I'll have a study that kind of looks at

this like the impacts of just minimizing

meat right like not I know there are

vegans who are like you should stop

eating anything related to animals and I

can respect that yeah but I also know

there are people who are going to have a

hard time giving up meat at all yeah and

like for me it's like okay I think if

you can convince people just on the

benefits of go like letting go of meat

not necessarily having to transform your

entire life because it's a challenge I

think that is the hardest part about

veganism is that you're like flipping

your entire diet which is way harder

than it seems yeah suddenly you're like

making meals and you're like I actually

don't know what to make like I can make

all the things I may be for without me

and without like any animal byproduct

but suddenly my plate is half empty or

I'm just like only eating like

rice you know it's like there's very

less being vegan for that time like now

that I've gone back to eating just

chicken like I don't really eat any

other meat

um it I am finding it so much easier

like I am eating vegan a lot because of

the skills I learned from forcing myself

to for a short period of time like it is

weird there's obviously in that end up

being vegan yeah and it is because you

do have to put in the effort and time to

like learn those tricks because it is

actually very um even a very robust

amazing meals and you have to learn like

you go okay now I gotta learn how to

cook in a variety of ways with tofu and

seitan and tempeh things that like we

didn't eat really that much before and

now I'm like I still buy all that stuff

and eat it all the time yeah because it

is like delicious and you but it's a

learning curve when you're just like oh

tofu is pretty bland like yeah am I just

supposed to eat this like like a cube of

tofu yeah but then you realize like you

can also make it taste better and it can

be part of stir fries and it can be like

there's all these ways to spice it up

um no pun intended pun intended so

where was it gonna go with this I think

I want to talk a little bit about the

environmental impact yeah the obvious

spoiler is that like veganism is better

for the environment full stop Venice any

diet than any other diet

so many research studies have found this

if it was questionable sometimes people

compare it to Mediterranean and they're

like is the Mediterranean diet actually

better for the environment now it's just

like you know the vegan diet is the best

for the environment and I think that's

important to talk about because

that's a huge convincing factor for a

lot of people including us yeah like I I

feel guilty saying this but like the

animal like welfare part sadly didn't

convince me of course I don't want to

think about animals suffering and I

don't want to like but yeah it was

always just when I was younger right it

was like when it became tied to the

environment and like consumption and use

of land and water it became like so many

extra factors to be like whoa you can

hit all these quote unquote Birds it was

like a bad analog tell all these

chickens yeah with ones don't or in fact

not kill all these chickens with one

stone and that's cool but I wanted to

talk through like the kind of like top

diets and which are the worst and which

are the best so

um the worst diet for the environment is

ironically the ketogenic diet these are

people who like primarily eat meat what

is keto it's like when you don't want

your body to like go into or it's when

you eating a lot of emphasis on foods

that are rich in fat and protein oh it's

like the low it's low carbs yeah reduces

carbs yeah oh yeah I remember but that

includes sugar sometimes you're around

I'll say it gays and uh sometimes they

sometimes you're just stuck around gay

guys and they spend a lot of time caring

about their bodies yeah I can say this

and you me not just gay no okay I'm just

using gaze as an example for me it's

like you'll meet them and they'll just

be like yeah I'm keto and you're like

and then you'll realize like they're

like I don't eat carrots like you

realize like

and you start like they're like the

vegetables are the problem yeah and you

start to realize like you're like oh

yeah of course that's the worst for the

environment because you end up only

being able to eat exactly cheese meat

pork beef and it's like holy [ __ ] like I

didn't know that like you weren't

allowed to eat like a cauliflower like

it's it's wild yeah when people are

really trying to I don't know get what

ripped like how again these are when

people talk to me and I'm just like

there is no way from all my nutrition

courses that in any way this is good for

you yeah but continue on so

unequivocally that was the worst one

like when they ranked them basically in

a horrible environment I'm sorry that is

what I'm referencing yeah so I think I

was thinking just about health but yeah

the second worst uh is the standard

American diet so this is just meals with

five food categories so grains protein

Dairy fruits vegetables and oils on the

side so it's kind of like everything oh

like the food just think about like what

Americans eat yeah the food guide and

they were this was split into two

categories those who include dark meat

and then those who only eat like chicken

and the chicken version was much lower

impact like the idea of like you gotta

have your meat and potatoes yeah and

that year it should hold to like do like

obviously having a variety of foods can

be healthy for you but we're talking

about the environment right now oh I

have to keep remembering that

environment the standard American diet

meat and potatoes the red meat being

included much worse and then people

who cut out red meat can make a bigger

difference if they're sticking to that

diet God I hate red meat next is Paleo

so this excludes processed foods refined

or artificial sugars salt grains legumes

and most dairy products what what is

Paleo paleo I think is people who are

like how do we eat like cave people

what is kind of in some ways it's like

how do we why would that exclude grains

and legumes maybe it's saying oh like

oh like maybe yeah like you have to eat

like the raw barley yeah like what are

you you're not eating rice that's white

rice because it's been like processed

whoa okay okay the next one's cool so

these we're getting into like the top

four now in terms of good these are like

significantly better now

um and it's called the climatarian which

I feel like I've heard before but a

climatarian diet a climatarian diet but

ironically it is not the best one okay

considering it's just the best one's

vegan yeah we know we're getting to

vegan but climatarian's number four so

it emphasizes local seasonal and fresh

food that requires minimal

Transportation refrigeration and

processing limits pork poultry and

sustainable fish consumption excludes

ruminant Meats limits pork poultry oh

okay and you're like sustainable so it's

like thinking about sustainability about

like how your food gets to you are you

like emitting a lot of CO2 just from

transporting food across the world

interesting and it does still though

limit ruminant because regardless of

like whether you're getting it from a

local Farm it's still like yeah exactly

it's still like cows take a lot of

resources

free ass chicken yeah like like a free

chicken frolicking in field yes that you

cut that was like down you know 100

kilometers away that's really

interesting that's a hard one in Canada

because in the winter it's like good

luck but like you know what I mean

climatarian is an interesting one yeah

because also I could see as a vegan I'd

be like okay

eat you can't claim that one what do you

mean like sorry oh it's like it's like

if you're like you know what I'm a

climatarian it's like are you all like

you know what I mean like every day

you're like where's my small batch milk

from like if you like it's something

that people could maybe claim more

easily than actually put in the work

sure but that can be true to like every

diet you can claim that you're a vegan

and then just like actually cheat

so if you actually are like a strong

climatearian you'd be like no I actually

need to put in the work yeah that's true

and I guess being really aware of where

your food comes from is still like

working hard to figure it out and you're

right in somewhere with extreme seasons

and extreme winter it would be much

harder like but that doesn't mean you

couldn't spend half the year being a

really good commentarian and then half

where you're like okay I have to like

kind of cheat or go outside of these

guidelines a little bit that's

interesting though can you read it again

what it said it says

um emphasizes local seasonal yeah and

fresh food that requires minimal

Transportation refrigeration and

processing no that is interesting and

just being like what is in season yeah

okay okay number three bronze medal

Mediterranean diet so this emphasizes

whole grains fruits and vegetables nuts

seeds legumes fish and olive oil as well

as meat Dairy and egg products and red

wine in moderation okay wow so the

Mediterranean French person for a long

time has been like very popular but that

still includes meat and egg yes but I

think it's just in a way more moderation

than most people especially like a North

American diet yeah like when you're

having like some fish sometime or like

small portions of meat like it's just

different than what we in sort of like

the North American culture or like the

Western culture like think about in

terms of meat consumption okay

interesting yeah

um and then you have vegetarian is

number two and so vegan is number one

okay wow vegan slay all day no this is

why I love vegans why I'm always like I

know obviously people like I don't know

yeah sometimes there's like

self-righteous vegans that can make you

mad for whatever reason but it seems

like such a small amount yeah of people

that there's so much like no it's like

they're doing the work yeah it's like

they're compassionate they're trying to

make the difference in the world in

their own life it's amazing like vegans

are amazing people and vegan restaurants

are amazing yeah and and I know we've

talked about this in a previous podcast

I don't have the study or stats in front

of me again right now but it's often

pawned off as like this very privileged

white thing but remember it's like

actually other cultures engage in

veganism at higher rates because they

come from communities and cultures that

are already like eating lots of

different fruits and veggies and stuff

as part of their cultural meals so it's

not just this like white thing yeah

despite there being a characterization

around it obviously in certain

neighborhoods one of the studies I read

was about that and the cost of being

vegan and how it's actually much cheaper

and it is not as much to do with wealth

and Status outside of specific vegan

products right so they were saying the

actual vegan diet when you're a vegan

you start to realize that a lot of what

you're consuming is beans and legumes

and canned potentially a lot of canned

food canned vegetables and if you can

like stick in that sort of space it can

be so much cheaper yeah

creating and making your own food it's

like to me where the veganism gets

expensive and sort of privileged just in

like restaurants and hip sort of like

Western food trying to translate they

said a lot of the Alternatives what what

happens is if you're trying to continue

to have like you know like there's

really fancy fake eggs really fancy fake

meats and it's like that is where

um that sort of stereotype comes in from

the research they did but they're like

if you're actually sticking to Whole

Foods and trying to change your diet not

necessarily keep it the same but like

use the products to make it like feel

like you didn't change your diet yeah

then it's way cheaper yeah and I was

like oh that's really interesting

because it is the all the vegan

Alternatives and the things that we buy

like and we still buy like those uh like

delicious like vegan meats from that

vegan fake sausages fake meat like

Israel and it's really expensive and

it's but it's like that's just us

pretending that we're still eating all

the same things yeah the only time I eat

beef for example is vegan beef yeah and

it's like I'm eating something that

tastes exactly like pizza and that is

because we come from a culture that

taught us how to like improve roast a

sausage so it's easier for us

mentally to be like well let's make like

hot dogs beyond meat and goddamn

business it's insane I'm like how much

pea protein am I I know that is because

I really like it I like it I don't eat

like red meat and pork and stuff like

that and I and I

I don't really remember the taste of

those things but I love Beyond me yeah

it's great I think for me it's like it's

clearly not good for you yeah yeah no it

can't be everything is fine but I think

like in the same way meat is like

there's like so much salt in these

there's so much fat there's so much like

it's their high high calorie they taste

amazing we're eating it for dinner so

yeah I mean I'm fine with that but it's

like from time to time I'm just like I

need to like be careful not to convince

myself that this is healthier oh I'm not

I'm I'm definitely not thinking it's

healthy when I eat beyond meat but I am

just like holy [ __ ] this is good and I

guess I'm not thinking it is

as bad as when if I was like a real

sausage for some reason it may not be I

mean like they're probably not one to

one there's probably benefits and

pitfalls of both but they certainly I

mean it's worse than can we should segue

more into just like Health generally

yeah so

um I mean I'll give them up front

spoiler again it's like most studies

find that vegans are healthier in most

ways the studies I was Finding was that

too it was really but they're they're

really new recently yeah what I will say

is like from anecdotally like

reading in this space and seeing studies

come out over the years

that has not been the tune for a long

time yeah and it's nice to see that

change like obviously I'm not like you I

want it to just like be what is the

actual result but a lot of the headlines

I get attention are like oh vegans lack

B12 and then they have the their like

lower energy and have these issues with

concentration a lot of that stuff gets

really blown up because it's like it's

Sensational right it's like so then

people fear oh my God if I go vegan I'm

gonna like have all these health issues

and there's a legitimate concern it's

not that that's wrong but from my

perspective I see those even on like

Reddit you see those studies like get a

lot more traction well yeah people

probably really want to like justify why

they're not vegan and to be like yeah

see it's like unhealthy yeah um but like

you said more and more you'll see like

even the studies that find the pitfalls

of veganism are able to objectively say

but in all these other markers you're

healthier yeah the study I found was 56

um it was 56 women they were the same

um

age same BMI and they kind of like their

health outcomes were so similar but some

were omnivores and some are vegan and

the vegans their VO2 max was much higher

they were able to push a lot longer to

exhaustion and their muscle strength was

the same and it was like interesting

because people always talk about VO2 max

and they were just like their VO2 max

and the vegans were so much higher even

though everything else was the same

other than their diet yeah I mean like

the question becomes like why is it this

way and I think what's yet to be

determined is

is it because vegetables are so good for

you and give you all these benefits or

is there something that any is actually

like detrimental and it might be both

right like there are so many like like

nitrates and preservatives and maybe

just inherently meat has like like there

is like in pro-inflammatory chemicals in

meat and anti-inflammatory chemicals and

vegetables so it's like Up For Debate if

like maybe if you're a meat eater at the

very least just add more vegetables yeah

add more fruit and veggie and like

you'll probably see some of those

benefits too but they don't know for

sure what it is yeah right now it's just

kind of like we see that vegans and

vegetarians are like are generally have

lower body weight lower cholesterol

longer lifespans lower rates of cancers

just like healthy in so many ways

there's also low blood pressure like

like a lot of stuff related to the heart

is like so much better we are gonna do a

video on it coming out because of all

the signs that's coming out now about

protein intake and how it's insane what

people say about how much protein you

need to consume in order to like build

muscle like that that like Tick Tock

Community which is like just like every

Fitness person it's always about protein

and the science is coming out that there

is a threshold that your body can

consume that like the amounts that

people are saying are just you're

pissing out like it's not just excreted

yeah like there are these crazy numbers

that I'm like I think that we need to

really get to the bottom of that people

get really obsessed over I mean I get it

if you're like trying to be like a

Olympic bodybuilder or something like

there's a difference and a lot of these

studies are studying that right like

they're studying people at the peak

Pinnacle Fitness because I see even

people say things like oh but like

protein in a lot of vegetables is less

bioavailable and like that might be true

like maybe there's research that shows

that oh like you're just like broccoli

is not as bad available as well like

there are certain yeah and a lot of

vegetables don't have complete proteins

but then it's like okay there are

solutions to this one you you just have

like multiple sources of protein like I

took PM lentils and tofu you don't even

mix it up but even when it comes to like

this optimization of protein consumption

it's like that's probably not related to

you like if you're just like an average

what do you say josmo or what do you say

Jane but but a lot of people are trying

to bulk up in the gym that is true the

trend of now but I think the difference

is marginal like when you're talking

about like one or two percent less

available I think people get so it's

like it's like anything with that but

yeah I see what you're saying or I just

mean it's like anything with Fitness

like people will talk about like the

positioning being so perfect to get your

pecs activated and like that's probably

true but it's also like if you're just

doing chests

like workouts you're gonna get a bigger

chest yeah yeah you know what I mean

yeah if you're a professional and you

actually need a two percent boost

because it's like gonna make you

actually perform at that top level then

maybe it makes sense but it's

interesting because

the studies that have come out on

athleticism and veganism

are as it stands right now

it's equally as good as a meat diet

whether or not it's optimal it's like

it's worth vegan there are yeah and more

and more are becoming vegans and like

someone even like Venus Williams has

like attributes veganism she has like a

chronic condition I forget the name of

it right now but it causes like extreme

fatigue in these things and she believes

that veganism is the reason that she can

like uh maintain and if it does have

anti-inflammatory properties is that

like inflammation's a big issue if

you're an athlete yeah inflammation and

recovery and even like beats like

increased blood flow and oxygenation to

your muscles that was our like third

ASAP science video it's like how to be

unbeatable and it was like the worst

title ever and no one watched it it was

all about how like beats actually can

make you a better high performance

runner in the Olympics it was like they

were running out of beats in the like

Olympic villains and everyone was like

relying on beads because it's like a way

that you can like improve without like

taking steroids and stuff

or whatever yeah um but I think that's

interesting that like it's good to know

know that if you want to change to a

veggie or vegan diet like you don't have

to worry about it like destroying your

ability even on tests of strength like

they've done studies where they like

over the course of eight or 12 weeks

start people on a meat diet see how like

dude like workouts and stuff and what

they can go to and then switch them to a

vegan diet to see if there's like any

decrease in performance and there's not

I can like

yeah it's sort of like mind-boggling to

think about why and how anyone would

even think I think because they're

healthier but there's just a narrative

around meat and protein and also also

the idea of like you have to be a vegan

who's still eating a lot of nutritious

things that can be the hard part too if

you're taking things out of your diet

and not replacing it totally you can be

a really unhealthy vegan yeah like

probably really easily yeah and I think

for a lot of people the hardest part

when you change to veganism or

vegetarianism is that you probably are

under eating because you're removing

things and like meat is like dense

compared to like just eating broccoli

like unless you're adding it and like

Downing like cans of beans is like hard

it's hard your stomach is so much more

full with less calories because it's

physically bigger there's so much fiber

in beans too that's like so good for you

yeah no there's amazing we should just

down beans we should and it already

farts so much I can't imagine what

happens late beans because I the more

you eat the more you also become

um your body adjusts I think there's an

adjustment period to your stomach to be

like okay I can start to build a

microbiome and bacteria to break this

down faster and better in a more

efficient way but if you're only doing

it once in a while you're just binge

beans one night you're probably gonna

fart a lot more yeah I'm not saying oh

and not vegan cheese which I love I'm

always like damn sure

like it's so good vegan cheese is so

good but I'm always like holy [ __ ] like

yeah it's intense it's like intense it's

like eating like 50 cashews yeah but I

think it is important for people to know

that if you are worried about Fitness

you can be equally as fit and studies

are now trying to discover can you

actually maybe be more optimally fit

yeah and people always be like my VO2

max and the study I found was that it

was just like vegans have higher VO2 max

when they try to account for everything

else yeah and that they had more muscle

strength or I know sorry it was equal on

top of it all and you it's like there's

all this slew of other benefits that we

just talked about like your actual

Health like it's one thing to want to be

strong fine that's like a totally fine

goal and I think it's important like as

much as we're demonizing me because of

its climate impacts and of course like

the ethical and moral impacts that some

people like see it as meat just on its

own inherently isn't like evil you know

what I mean like in moderation that's

why the Mediterranean diet is like so uh

revered the wrong word but it's like so

healthy people are still having moderate

amounts of meat because then you don't

have to worry about things like B12

deficiencies or omega-3 like lack and um

calcium intake

um that is like a big one bone density

so like when it comes to like the

pitfalls of being a vegan bone density

is this thing that they keep coming up

against like vegans get more bone

fractures and no one knows why hmm and I

always think I was telling this to you

the other day like

weirdly when you look at other countries

that don't drink a lot of milk

they don't have this same problem

because you can get calcium from like

broccoli like tons of

vegetables but weirdly when we just look

at vegans people who are specifically

vegan

and don't drink milk they have all these

like a way higher rate of bone breaks so

they don't know what the reason is yeah

it could be one of those confounding

variables because even then they've been

like oh maybe we're not accounting for

the fact that vegans in general take in

less calcium so they redo the studies

and they go okay what about vegans who

eat the same amount of calcium that

people who drink milk have yeah and

still vegans have like more likely to

break their bones huh and while it is

like but if they're just like more

active in doing more things that look

breaker honestly it's it's possible but

I don't know like I can't say what the

reason is and no one really knows there

might be another confounding variable or

it's like all vegans are also rocked

ones

um but it's something that's maybe

important to know is that studies on

kids when it comes to Bone problems is

like pretty unequivocal like kids who

drink more milk break their bones less

well when they're adults it's like some

studies find variation and it's like

it's like questionable not questionable

so like all kids are drinking milk yeah

it's like important like I think it's

it's the question of like if people are

vegan themselves and they are choosing

to make their kid vegan it's like

there's still research that's trying to

figure out like how can you do that in a

healthy way yeah and I'm not saying like

not too obvious you can be very healthy

but right now when it comes to just that

specifically bone density kids who drink

less milk are more likely to have

um broken bones oh damn how but again

it's that same kind of thing where it's

like I don't know maybe it's not because

of the milk maybe it's because of

something else and that's just to do

with milk yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah and

then when I picture a kid I picture like

a nasty milk stash and just like I want

my milk

yeah of course they're drinking milk

because like all they like like

um

but what was I gonna say so are you

going to think about being vegan again I

think okay yeah no because I've been on

this train of like we started eating

meat a little bit again because we were

traveling and I've been like trying to

like up my fitness and you know I've

been convinced by this industry that

like I need to have so much protein and

so like I was like okay I'll get that a

good amount from meat or whatever and

protein powder and I'm like I don't want

to eat so much freaking protein powder

that can't be good for me yeah no I feel

weird when I'm just like getting so it

feels like it's like soil and green but

I think I am back on the train of like

how can I make sure

at least at home and like really

minimizing the consumption and focusing

on the other ways to up that whether

that be through just like I think Whole

Foods or tofu or seitan and that but but

I think that we don't prioritize like

cooking in our life I think like that's

a big part of it I think like

I'm only recently just starting to try

and like get into kicking like kill me

now look at me making the same Meals

forever I'm trying to like mix things up

and that I think is where it could

become easier if you're someone who's

like interested in cooking and making

meals I feel like being vegan would be

really

could have a lot of fun with it yeah

because it's like you're actually

already putting in that work and I think

that's the thing I need to remember that

when we were vegan I don't think we

really even got that in to the culture

of cooking it and if you could I think

that maybe yeah I think like I need I

need better access to things that are

easy because I'm a lazy cook and I'm

just like I'm hungry now I just need to

make something and so not that like meat

is so easy to cook and to be clear like

I almost never ever eat red meat it

would just be like chicken and I'm just

like I can literally just bake that and

it can be healthy and that's that

um but I'm just like what else can I

make quickly and just like either throw

in the oven that doesn't feel overly

processed like we get a lot of those

like veggie chicken bites and stuff like

that and they're fine but sometimes I'm

like is this good or is this bad veggie

chicken like those chicken tenders for

example oh yeah that are like probably

soy base no yeah that's not like I'm

like there's a lot in this that's like

not a whole food and I think my first

goal was like how can I eat more Whole

Foods yeah so then I know like okay I'm

just eating like things from this Earth

and that feels like an easy way to be

healthy or to minimize like processed

foods now I'm like how do I amplify the

beans and the chickpeas and the lentils

and the seitan and the tempeh I mean it

all sounds so good yeah but like seitan

and tofu and these things are like

pretty highly processed yeah that

doesn't always mean it's bad but it's

like trying to balance it out and I

think that's the stage I'm at it like

how do I slowly move back to being

vegetarian yeah yeah I think I think

you're right like we need to and from

there I think if I can successfully

become vegetarian maybe I can aim for

like levels of veganism because the

truth is like we probably many times

like a big chunk of the week might

actually be eating vegan without

realizing it actually that's not true

for me because I have eggs almost every

morning yeah but I think because I don't

eat eggs it's like I do think I end up

doing that a lot too but the other

challenge that I think is interesting is

about claiming it is when you get

together with other people yeah and you

go away for a weekend or you go to your

family and it's like

there is power in deciding you are

something and not because it helps other

people understand what needs to be made

well I don't know that's the hardest

part yeah the hardest I don't it's just

it's a part that is a hard part for me

because I feel really weird about

inconveniencing other people in that way

yeah so like I it's I've always had a

hard time being like going to visit my

family and being like can you make a

vegetarian version of a vegetarian

becomes like at least easier yeah just

like if we're ever visiting your family

just take the meat out or like yeah

veggie burger yeah we'll just bring

veggie burgers we can throw them on the

grill yeah that is easier to like

explain to my family yeah and to be like

yeah I think if I ever was vegan that

was what would happen it would be like

in my personal life I would do vegan and

then when I'm out it would be vegetarian

just to like simplify until until I have

a system that can provide for myself in

those moments but even like going out

with friends and restaurants like

yeah it's an amazing skill that people

who are strong vegans are able to

probably be like I know where I can go I

know what I can't yeah but I like am

weak in that way and I'm like I'm just

happy to appease like what does everyone

else want yeah I'll go wherever yeah and

just eat whatever like and sometimes

people like when you claim it people

overthink what they need to do they're

like oh they're coming so we have to

change things whereas like then you just

go you have a normal meal and no one

says anything and there's still a lot of

vegetarian food that is being eaten and

it's like I think it's like if you're

gonna claim it too you have to try and I

think to be a good person you have to

like take a lot of the responsibility on

yourself and be like I will bring

something or I will yeah nowadays like

we live in a major city and most places

we're visiting every restaurant has a

vegetarian option maybe it's not super

healthy like maybe it's just like a

plain salad no but that's like that at

least in Toronto like for years and it

was like we never felt like we were

getting shafted it was more like um this

is yeah and unless you're going to a

meat specific place that does like

barbecue meat then you just have to be

like I literally can't go there but at

least in major like a major city like

such a Food City like Toronto it's not

it's actually you're not just like

getting forced to eat a mac and cheese

although that sounds amazing it's like I

want that so yeah I think it's my goal

to like move towards this

um veganism is still a step away from me

just because it's a challenge and I know

that's like kind of I could get dragged

for saying you know

but no I think it's like taking baby

steps yeah and I feel the same way when

talking to meat eaters like about being

vegetarian or about being primarily

vegetarian it's like just start by

minimizing a bit of what you like taking

out red meat and see how it feels and

things yeah because it gives you that

space to slowly fill that Gap instead of

like literally taking everything you eat

away and being like try and eat now yeah

try and cook now like you have to panic

and look up a recipe for every single

meal it's exhausting yeah and as we've

said in my life hack episode I'm like

somebody who needs to have the same meal

like all the time otherwise I overthink

it so I just need to like get my

repertoire of like tonight the meal I

want to make is just like a chill it's

gonna be vegan yeah tonight the meal I'm

making is gonna be very good yeah but

it's like with beyond meat sausage it's

pretending to not yeah and I'm sure

there's lots of times where we don't

realize like the bread we're having

isn't vegan or like some ingredient in

the cracker is not vegan so it's just

like putting the work in to eventually

get there bit by bit cool well slay all

day vegans yeah honestly end of the day

veganism is way better for the

environment than anything and really

healthy really good for your health I

would say just be aware the nicest thing

is you you can take supplements for

almost every problem and I'm gonna love

B12

Omega calcium you can take supplements a

lot of foods are fortified with these

things

and I would just like personally not

overthink the bone density thing outside

of like maybe being a child or a kid and

we're gonna do the video and the podcast

about protein consumption and how I feel

like everyone's eating way too much

protein probably so we'll definitely

next to you yeah we're in a protein era

yeah okay o thanks for listening